Implement Karl Sims Evolved Behaviors

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KWVance
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Joined: Thu Jan 25, 2018 4:10 pm

Implement Karl Sims Evolved Behaviors

Post by KWVance » Thu Jan 25, 2018 5:03 pm

This game of evolution is very interesting. however, my main issue with it is that creatures start out knowing how to locomote. For true evolution to take place everything must be learned.

Karl Sims (ironic last name) did experiments with this in 1994 by having a series of randomly generated shapes with an auto rig thrash about for a limited time, then compare the distance of the various creatures at the end of the time. Then the traits of ones with the highest scores were combined. These are called EVCs (evolved virtual creatures)

People use EVC to help AI robots understand how to walk on different terrain before building them. However these used predetermined shapes and rigs. Limiting their potential. It is our arrogance that makes us believe bipedal is the most efficient form of locomotion.

recent strides have been made to EVCs in implementing advanced morphology to do multiple tasks. Such as reaching high objects (such as a food source) in addition to locomotion. Another advancedment is the ability simulate muscle tissue in the creatures.

One of the people that worked on these experiments directly (Dan Lessin) is on YouTube, and may very well be willing to help! I wrote an essay in college about EVCs and wrote him, he was very insightful. (Link to one of his videos down below)

The developers will need more help with this. But it should not be hard to get if they start showcasing this game as experiment to places like universities

This should not be difficult, as EVC experiments have been done with things like locomotion, predictor/prey simulations, cooperation simulations, and multiple learned behaviors. But never all at the same time.

That's what this program should be. Ambitious yes, even now this program is unlike anything out there. It has to aim high. Personally, I believe it will be a program similar to this that will one day give birth to artificial general intelligence.

The first step to implement EVCs to this game is to add true physics. and gravity. If a creature falls over and can't get up, it starves.

[youtube]https://youtu.be/fyVr7gdGEPE[/youtube]

More on Dan Lessin: https://real.itu.dk/people/former-members/dan-lessin/

docsy
Posts: 75
Joined: Sat Jul 29, 2017 8:50 pm

Re: Implement Karl Sims Evolved Behaviors

Post by docsy » Thu Jan 25, 2018 7:17 pm

Lemme preface this by saying that you're right, ideally we should have things like this to be realistic, but there's unfortunately problems with trying to make that happen. Quoting the FAQ:
What future features are out of the question, then?

[...]

Rigid-body physics. There are too many creatures being simulated to make realistic physical movement viable. With that said, we plan to do 'fake' (precalculated) limb physics, and to take the stat-based physics as far/deep as material density and volume calculations.
At the moment, the game runs 300-700 creatures as the normal world count, and running real physics on all of those would slow the game to a halt. Perhaps you could make it happen by mass culling features, but imo it's not worth it. A supercomputer could pull off your suggestion, but right now this game is designed for your typical PC. I love your idea of reaching for the stars with this game, but sadly I don't think home computing technology is there yet for this.

docsy
Posts: 75
Joined: Sat Jul 29, 2017 8:50 pm

Re: Implement Karl Sims Evolved Behaviors

Post by docsy » Fri Jan 26, 2018 12:30 am

Might I suggest you try out Critterdings? It's similar but reverses the size-performance tradeoff of species. It has real physics on its creatures but can't simulate as many at a time or have a lot of the looks and features of species.

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