Ethics, Morality and the Value of Human Life

[Alienbird]

This topic was originally meant to be a discussion of Bill Nye's recent book. However, it has gone wayyy off topic and is now deep into the much more interesting (to me) subjects of ethics, morality, the value of human life, the contributions of religion to social advancement or societal backwardness, ect. I changed the title so that new people can find this very interesting discussion.

[White parrot]

I recently read "Undeniable: Evolution and the Science of Creation" by Bill Nye. It [...]

Oh oh.

(Note: I have been assured that “the science guy” is a mandatory part of his name and that if you don’t use it he magically scientifically appears and beats you over the head with a Bunsen burner).

(seen here)

WHAT HAVE YOU DONE

Oh wait I forgot to AAAARGH PLEASE NO NO NO NOT THE BUNSEN BUR-

RUN WHILE YU STILL CAN

Cannot participate in the discussion, I didn't read that book.

[Riulus]

Neither can I. At any rate, all I can say is that trying to disprove it to those of us who actually believe in creationism is as easy as making a brick turn into gas. That is to say, not at all.
Although... if we are running the figures that Qu came up with during his blog, I think we can safely say that turning a human being into pure energy is all we really need to vaporize clay, and then some.

On a side note, I finally figured out how to link stuff to words instead of pasting the actual url and hoping to god you people clicked the link.
I'M FUCKING LEARNING!!!!1!

[Alienbird]

I would love it if Bill Nye scientifically appeared with his Bunsen burner in hand. I would totally like to meet the guy. We could stare at awesome wiggly creatures through my microscope together and discuss ornithology, entomology, microscopy, ecology, ocean acidification and the local starfish wipeout, ect.

Neither can I. At any rate, all I can say is that trying to disprove it to those of us who actually believe in creationism is as easy as making a brick turn into gas.

I know. My best friend since High School is a Young Earth Creationist. We steer clear of the subject entirely when hanging out together.

[Riulus]

I know. My best friend since High School is a Young Earth Creationist. We steer clear of the subject entirely when hanging out together.

Personally, I'm sort of a Young Earth Creationist. My opinion on the matter is very different from others, however, as I doubt the way we are now is the way we were originally created. In other words, I feel that the world was indeed created personally in seven days, but we evolved to fit better to the environment once sin took hold. After all, in the Bible it does say that the world grew alot more hostile once Adam and Eve's sin was exposed. I may be wrong about that though, its been a while since I read the Bible, let alone Genesis.

[20 characters!]

I know. My best friend since High School is a Young Earth Creationist. We steer clear of the subject entirely when hanging out together.

Personally, I'm sort of a Young Earth Creationist. My opinion on the matter is very different from others, however, as I doubt the way we are now is the way we were originally created. In other words, I feel that the world was indeed created personally in seven days, but we evolved to fit better to the environment once sin took hold. After all, in the Bible it does say that the world grew alot more hostile once Adam and Eve's sin was exposed. I may be wrong about that though, its been a while since I read the Bible, let alone Genesis.

You will hate me for saying what I beleive, I believe sin and punishment are artificial constructs created in a poor attempt to create docility among the populace.

And generally do more harm than good.

Also very few people actually read the whole bible all the way through, I have heard that the ones who do come out disgusted and pessimistic.

[Tiberius]

I know. My best friend since High School is a Young Earth Creationist. We steer clear of the subject entirely when hanging out together.

Personally, I'm sort of a Young Earth Creationist. My opinion on the matter is very different from others, however, as I doubt the way we are now is the way we were originally created. In other words, I feel that the world was indeed created personally in seven days, but we evolved to fit better to the environment once sin took hold. After all, in the Bible it does say that the world grew alot more hostile once Adam and Eve's sin was exposed. I may be wrong about that though, its been a while since I read the Bible, let alone Genesis.

You will hate me for saying what I beleive, I believe sin and punishment are artificial constructs created in a poor attempt to create docility among the populace.

And generally do more harm than good.

Also very few people actually read the whole bible all the way through, I have heard that the ones who do come out disgusted and pessimistic.

Technically yes christianity was used keep the serfs happy and when it became more lax europeans became influential and more prone to rebellion/revolution but do you mean that laws only exist do keep people docile?

[20 characters!]

Personally, I'm sort of a Young Earth Creationist. My opinion on the matter is very different from others, however, as I doubt the way we are now is the way we were originally created. In other words, I feel that the world was indeed created personally in seven days, but we evolved to fit better to the environment once sin took hold. After all, in the Bible it does say that the world grew alot more hostile once Adam and Eve's sin was exposed. I may be wrong about that though, its been a while since I read the Bible, let alone Genesis.[/quote]

You will hate me for saying what I beleive, I believe sin and punishment are artificial constructs created in a poor attempt to create docility among the populace.

And generally do more harm than good.

Also very few people actually read the whole bible all the way through, I have heard that the ones who do come out disgusted and pessimistic.[/quote]


Technically yes christianity was used keep the serfs happy and when it became more lax europeans became influential and more prone to rebellion/revolution but do you mean that laws only exist do keep people docile?[/quote]

No sometimes laws exist for worse reasons, to make politicans feel like they are doing something to oppress minorites to give companies more rights ect.
Granted some exist to improve uppon the libertys of the people but those are to few and far between.

[Tiberius]

No sometimes laws exist for worse reasons, to make politicans feel like they are doing something to oppress minorites to give companies more rights ect.
Granted some exist to improve uppon the libertys of the people but those are to few and far between.

That sounds kind of like what some of my family feels about religion in that there is some deity but organized religion does nothing but oppression. I personally feel that most laws allow society to function in a civilized manner but I do agree that some percentage of laws are wrong/corrupt and only really give power to the strong. For example Canada's Senators are appointed by the Prime minister not elected.

[Riulus]

You will hate me for saying what I believe, I believe sin and punishment are artificial constructs created in a poor attempt to create docility among the populace.

And generally do more harm than good.

Also very few people actually read the whole bible all the way through, I have heard that the ones who do come out disgusted and pessimistic.

yea, you were right about one thing: I didn't like that at all. I'm not going to argue the point, but it certainly feels like you're saying that ethics are nonexistent. It's pretty much an Ethical Egoist standpoint: if we try to do good we're just hurting people, so the only thing we can do is look out for ourselves. Granted, there were probably people who just wanted to maintain power when they made those laws that established serfdom. Problem is, is that if we don't ever try to do something with the good of more than oneself in mind, then we'd have destroyed the majority of our next generation by now.

Like I said, I don't want to argue the point, mainly because I spent two fucking months doing research on the ethics of abortion and I don't even want to think logically right now